Jean-Christophe Hérault Interview: “Those Fireplace And Leather Notes Conjure Up An Entire World”

Jean-Christophe Hérault

IMAGE: IFF.

Creed Aventus. We’ve all heard of the decade-defining fragrance. But it’s only recently that its creator, Jean-Christophe Hérault, is being acknowledged for his part in its phenomenal success. Read my interview with Gabe Oppenheim, author of The Ghost Perfumer: Creed, Lies, & The Scent of the Century (Solicitude), for more on that scented saga.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Creed Aventus EDP

Jean-Christophe Hérault deserves all the credit he’s getting for that 2010 release that’s spawned a mini-industry of clones, dupes and smell-a-likes (Oppenheim’s book again provides admirable detail here). But, as the summary below of some of his creations shows, there’s so much more to the Paris-based perfumer than Creed Aventus.

+ Balenciaga Florabotanica EDP (2012)

+ Comme des Garçons Amazingreen EDP (2012)

+ Karl Lagerfeld For Him EDT (2014)

+ Viktor & Rolf Spicebomb Extreme EDP (2015)

+ Boucheron Ambre d’Alexandrie EDP (2017)

+ Mugler Alien Man EDT (2018)

+ Azzaro Wanted Girl EDP (2019)

+ Paco Rabanne Lady Million Empire EDP (2019)

+ Dolce & Gabbana The One For Men EDP Intense (2020)

+ Roberto Cavalli Paradise Found For Men EDT (2020)

+ Coach Open Road EDT (2022)

+ Valentino Uomo Born In Roma Coral Fantasy EDT (2022)

+ Jacques Fath Vetiver Gris Parfum (2022)

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Balenciaga Florabotanica EDP

IMAGE: Balenciaga.

While his father produced concentrates for the fragrance industry and Jean-Christophe Hérault initially pursued an internship in fragrance control after studying chemistry, his life took a dramatic turn when he met Pierre Bourdon.

The legendary perfumer (creator of Yves Saint Laurent Kouros EDT, Davidoff Blue Water EDT and Creed Green Irish Tweed EDP, among others) noticed something special in him and took him on as a trainee perfumer. This involved reading Marcel Proust’s classic six-volume novel In Search of Lost Time (Le Temps Perdu) before learning any of the technical expertise of the profession.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Coach Open Road EDT

Early creations of Jean-Christophe Hérault include Canali Men EDT (2005), Grès My Dream Hommage à Marlene Dietrich EDP (2008) and Canali dal 1934 EDP (2009). They saw the perfumer playing with the pineapple note he perfected in Creed Aventus.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Grès My Dream Hommage à Marlene

IMAGE: Parfums Grès.

In this interview, the senior perfumer at International Fragrance & Flavors (IFF) talks about the influence of Pierre Bourdon, his fondness for smoky, leathery notes and the power of wonderment.

Jean-Christophe Hérault

IMAGE: IFF.

You grew up between Paris and Oise (north of Paris) and your father produced concentrates for the perfume industry. Did you know from an early age that you wanted to become a perfumer? 

Since childhood, I have always been attracted to scents and perfumes. Perfumes are olfactive stories that move people on a different scale, much more profoundly and durably than other perceptions.

I initially worked in quality control for Fragrance Resources in Grasse. Working in Grasse opened my senses; smelling perfumery ingredients, raw materials and fragrances produced at the factory was truly mesmerising. Then I was fortunate to meet Pierre Bourdon, who helped me write my life’s next chapter.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Dolce & Gabbana The One For Men EDP Intense

That must have been a life-changing experience… 

Being mentored by Pierre Bourdon was the most rewarding, beautiful, and complex experience of my life. It was a true gift from God to be trained by a perfumer I admire so much for his talent, choices, erudition, intelligence and articulacy.

He is a creative visionary and is able to beautifully share what he has seen, heard, or felt through fragrances. He taught me a lot about creation and becoming a professional creative.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Comme des Garçons Amazingreen EDP

What do you remember most from your time with him?

Before Pierre Bourdon started training me, he encouraged me to smell flowers. When you come from Paris, you do not know the smell of mimosa, jasmine, centifolia rose, lavender and lavandin cultivars. Even aromatic herbs are a discovery when you smell them in the heat, in the Mediterranean garigue. It fuelled my imagination and my passion.

He also encouraged me to look at chromatographs [the technique of separating a mixture into its individual components] to learn and memorise how a blackcurrant base, a rose essence, or a jasmine absolute are composed. He told me to use that time to learn as much as possible.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Viktor & Rolf Spicebomb Extreme EDP

IMAGE: Viktor & Rolf.

Do you still ask him for advice?

I don’t really ask him for advice anymore. I believe a relationship with a mentor always has a beginning and an end.

Davidoff Cool Water Parfum is one of your recent creations from 2021. Pierre Bourdon created the 1988 original. Did you feel additional pressure taking on this project?

Not really. I was proud, though. As Pierre Bourdon’s former trainee, I immensely enjoyed working on this project. I wanted to ensure the continuity of the Cool Water story in an impressive way.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Davidoff Cool Water Parfum

IMAGE: Davidoff.

How would you describe your style of perfumery?

It is always difficult for a perfumer to describe their personal style.

Fair enough. What do you hope to achieve with your creations?

Time hones your technique; you store tons of information, which helps you make shortcuts. We are only free once our knowledge is broad enough to play around with all the information we have in our minds.

But you have to keep that technique and knowledge on a leash, keep it at the right distance to preserve the freshness and the time spent daydreaming about the simple pleasures of childhood, which are so authentic and powerful, and resonate with so many people.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Creed Aventus EDP

You must force yourself to continue seeing things with a child’s eyes, unencumbered by logic. That wonderment is what I give in my compositions. It’s the springboard to conveying emotions.

“That wonderment is what I give in my compositions. It’s the springboard to conveying emotions.” – Jean-Christophe Hérault

You’re getting recognition at last as the creator of Creed Aventus. What thoughts come to your mind when you see this super-successful scent?

I’ll never forget the Creed Aventus project. I worked directly with Olivier Creed and was given free rein. It was a true creative journey.

Have you read Gabe Oppenheim’s book? Your thoughts please.

I have received a copy, but still need to take the time to read it.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - The Ghost Perfumer

Do you have a favourite ingredient? Could you give an example of where and how you’ve used it?

I am very fond of smoky, leathery notes suggesting the smell of an open fire. There is a leathery note in Alien Man by Mugler expressed in smoky notes extracted from beech. In Aventus by Creed, I also used smoky notes.

“I like highly evocative ingredients, even when they are only present in trace amounts.”  – Jean-Christophe Hérault

I like highly evocative ingredients, even when they are only present in trace amounts. Those fireplace and leather notes conjure up an entire world – a season, the countryside, the mountains, a new school bag, shoes and my mother’s fragrance, Shalimar by Guerlain.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Mugler Alien Man EDT

IMAGE: Mugler.

What perfume project have you just completed and what can you tell us about it? 

Kenzo Memori Poudre Matcha is a gentle and nostalgic fragrance, the embodiment of a happy memory, reminiscent of the Japanese tea ceremony. It is a beautiful cloud of matcha tea, velvet rose and white musk.

Jean-Christophe Hérault - Kenzo Memori Poudre Matcha EDP

IMAGE: Kenzo.

What gets you through a stressful time?

Taking a stroll outside has always helped me to relax. We are fortunate to have a beautiful park next to our offices, one of the largest company parks in Paris.

There’s no doubting your perfume skills. What are your other passions?

I have always loved literature. Pierre Bourdon asked me to read In Search of Lost Time by Proust before I started working with him; it was part of our “contract”. This masterpiece shows that there are aesthetic forms everywhere that can touch and inspire us. An encounter, a feeling, be it love or sadness. This book helped me accept myself as a creative.

IMAGE: The Folio Society.

I am fascinated by art history, which led me to take classes at the Beaux-Arts de Paris. The subject has immensely contributed to my inspiration for perfume creation.

I am also fond of anything to do with culinary arts. There are many bridges between perfumery and cuisine, and I believe there are many more to build; the possibilities are endless.

Creed Aventus EDP is available in South Africa at Skins Cosmetics

Louise Turner Interview: “Competition Is Part Of A Perfumer’s Life”

Louise Turner

IMAGE: Givaudan.

You might not have heard of Louise Turner if you’re not in the perfume industry. But you’ve most certainly seen / smelled one of her creations:

+ Jennifer Lopez JLo Glow EDT (2002)

+ Joop! Wolfgang Joop EDT (2008)

+ Chloé Love EDP (2010)

+ Roberto Cavalli EDP (2012)

+ Maison Martin Margiela Replica Lazy Sunday Morning EDT (2013)

+ Dior Miss Dior Blooming Bouquet EDT (2014)

+ Jimmy Choo Blossom EDP (2015)

+ Hugo Boss Boss The Scent Private Accord For Her EDP (2018)

+ Tom Ford Lost Cherry EDP (2018)

+ Ex Nihilo Lust in Paradise EDP (2019)

+ Carolina Herrera Bad Boy EDT (2019)

+ Jo Malone Hemlock & Bergamot Cologne (2019)

+ Mugler Angel Nova EDP (2020)

+ Les Liquides Imaginaires Blanche Bête EDP (2021)

+ Dries Van Noten Raving Rose EDP (2022)

Louise Turner

IMAGE: Givaudan.

Oh, and then there’s the super-successful Carolina Herrera Good Girl franchise, with its numerous flankers and limited editions from 2016 onwards.

Medicine’s loss was perfumery’s gain when the Brit dropped out of medical school and found herself a job working in the market research company of a fragrance-producing company. Although Louise Turner didn’t follow the traditional perfumery school route, her nascent skills caught the attention of Quest’s Alain Garossi and she was on her way…

Louise Turner - Roberto Cavalli EDP

Her fine fragrance debuts from 2001 – Trussardi Python Uomo EDT and Versace Versus Time To Relax EDT – have disappeared into the mists of the discontinued and forgotten. But the massive success of JLo Glow ensured Louise Turner had no reason to regret her change in career path.

In this interview, we chat about her unconventional training, competing for briefs and dealing with stress. It’s clear her time in France has influenced her vocabulary, so I’ve kept the occasional French word intact.

Louise Turner - Mugler Angel Nova EDP

IMAGE: Mugler.

Where did perfumery start for you? Any particular events / memories that sparked this passion?

I have always been sensitive to odour and notice and associate smells with places and people. But like a lot of people didn’t know about this job until I literally tripped over it – my destiny!

Where did you study? And what did you most enjoy / find challenging about that experience?

I was following a medical path, with a dentistry option, at a medical school in London. A big mistake as I didn’t want to be a dentist. So after I dropped out and went back home to Kent to rethink what I wanted to do with my life, I chose to study environmental science. With almost 10 months before I could restart my uni course, I found myself a student job in the market research department of Quest International (a fragrance company taken over by Givaudan in 2007).

Louise Turner - Maison Martin Margiela Replica Lazy Sunday Morning EDT

IMAGE: Maison Martin Margiela.

So there began my love affaire with perfume. I suppose I was in the right place at the right time as, after making a nuisance of myself and passing several smelling tests and interviews, Quest offered me a job as a trainee perfumer that I would start three years later after completing my studies.

Did you have a mentor?

I started in the UK in 1991 under a perfumer grassois [from Grasse] Alain Garossi who taught me the principles and helped to start my career – thank you, Alain! I then spent one year in the Netherlands before finally coming to Paris in 1996 (my dream) to start fine fragrance. I was supposed to stay two years and 26 years later, I’m still here.

Louise Turner - Dries Van Noten Raving Rose EDP

IMAGE: Dries Van Noten.

Certainly not the usual route…

It was a vastly different world then. I have a rather unconventional training, as most people I work with have either been to Isipca [the Versailles-based perfume school founded by Jean-Jacques Guerlain in 1970] or have been formed at the Givaudan Perfumery School. I don’t think I would make the cut to get into the latter school today, as it is so difficult with so many people wanting to make this their career. I was really lucky!

“I don’t think I would make the cut to get into the Givaudan Perfumery School today, as it is so difficult with so many people wanting to make this their career. ” – Louise Turner

Tell us about the fragrance that got your career going. What do you think about it now?

Glow by JLo was a real phenomenon and unexpected success. The licence was with Coty at that time and Jennifer Lopez was directly involved in its creation – she wanted the smell of clean and fresh skin, which was inspired by the smell of a particular soap she used.

Louise Turner - JLo Glow EDT

How do you start each project?

Each project is different, so I adapt depending on the client and their approach and expectations.

However, I nearly always start with a quite simple idea that’s usually figurative – for example, peony with spicy chutney – and develop it from there.

The creation of perfumes involves competing for briefs from various companies. Please explain how that process works. Is it something you enjoy?

The process is always competitive and client driven, either via a specific project that will be briefed to us and other fragrance companies or via a themed library approach where, for example, we are asked to submit new feminine oriental ideas.

Louise Turner - Dior Miss Dior Blooming Bouquet EDT

IMAGE: Dior.

However, the competition is mostly felt internally as we perfumers are competing against each other and we rarely see the external competition.

Competition is part of a perfumer’s life – not the easiest thing to manage sometimes and keep the focus on your own game.

Let’s chat about the phenomenal success of Carolina Herrera Good Girl. What would people be surprised to know about this creation?

Good Girl is an amazing success – also very unexpected, as when we first launched it in 2016, it was destined for Spain, Latin America and Russia. But the interest kept on growing, which meant more and more launches worldwide. I travelled more for it than any other perfume.

Louise Turner - Carolina Herrera Good Girl Suprême EDP

There have been numerous Good Girl flankers since the launch of the original in 2016. How have you remained faithful to it while adding something different each time?

It is a simple idea of jasmine and tonka. It is very contrasted and powerful but success is always due to the mix: good perfume, bottle, name, advertising campaign and a good dose of luck.

Each flanker tells a different story while keeping the DNA of Good Girl. I worked on all these flankers with Quentin Bisch [colleague at Givaudan]. We work together a lot. He is the greatest.

Louise Turner - Carolina Herrera Good Girl EDP Suprême

Provocative name aside, Tom Ford Lost Cherry EDP must have been interesting to work on. What was it like to collaborate with Mr Ford on this 2018 release?  

Working with Mr Ford is always a privilege. Such freedom of expression is a rarity today. Lost Cherry was a change for the brand in that it was the first fruity fragrance that he accepted – a new territory to conquer.

Louise Turner - Tom Ford Lost Cherry EDP

IMAGE: Tom Ford.

The unisex D by Diesel is one of your latest projects. More designer brands, at last, are going this route. Your thoughts please.

D expresses that tendance [tendency] for gender fluidity (which TF has been doing for a very long time). It’s good to allow people to choose what they really like rather than being pushed into gender-defined choices by obligation.

Louise Turner - Diesel D EDT

IMAGE: Diesel.

You’re equally at home creating perfumes for niche brands such as Ex Nihilo, Les Liquides Imaginaires and Maison Martin Margiela. How do these projects give you more creative freedom?

Yes, niche gives more freedom and is simpler to develop as it’s often direct ideas with only one person, so it’s much more straight to the point. They’re a breath of fresh air.

Louise Turner - Les Liquides Imaginaires Blanche Bête EDP

IMAGE: Les Liquides Imaginaires.

Behind the beautiful and glamorous façade, perfumery can be a high-pressure environment. How do you deal with the stress? 

Perfumery can be stressful, particularly for someone like me who has a “stressed personality”, as everything is so fast and our clients are increasingly demanding.

“I try to deal with it by working from home part of the time (from my house in Normandy ) and working in my garden.” – Louise Turner

So I try to deal with it by working from home part of the time (from my house in the Normandy countryside) and working in my garden. Working with your hands is very good for destressing, especially when you’re in direct contact with nature.

Electimuss: Interview With Creative Director Claire Sokell Thompson

Electimuss - Claire Sokell Thompson

If you spend a fair amount of time on Instagram, you’ll have seen the stop-scrolling majestic bottles. But as this interview with Claire Sokell Thompson, Electimuss creative and communications director, will show you, there’s more to the London-based niche brand than eye candy.

Electimuss Black Caviar Parfum

The company was founded by Luke Granger and Jason Collison in 2015, with the myths, legends and history of ancient Rome as a rich source of inspiration (Electimuss means “to choose the best” in Latin).

Electimuss Mercurial Cashmere Box

While the brand has been around for seven years, it’s only recently that Electimuss has really started to take off. Its growing popularity is based on high-quality juices by perfumers who know how to give their creations luxurious oomph. See my reviews of Black Caviar, Mercurial Cashmere and Vici at the end of this interview.

Claire Sokell Thompson joined the team in 2020 and her influence can be seen in the house’s more cohesive creative direction. In this interview we chat about inspiration, perfumer briefings and 2023 projects.

Electimuss Sample

Let’s get the obvious question out of the way first. Those gorgeous bottles, Who designed them?

Thank you so much! We get a lot of positive feedback on them. They are a masterpiece of many hands and, in fact, we’re working on a new evolution at the moment.

The brand launched in 2015 and has really made an impression over the last few years. It’s not as easy as it looks, though, so tell us about a specific problem Electimuss had to overcome. 

In terms of our brand, we’re so lucky we’ve had so much support and passion from our customer base and retailers. The most difficult issues for us, like many of our compatriot brands, have been Covid and Brexit related in terms of supply, logistics and distribution.

Electimuss Mercurial Cashmere Parfum

Did you know Jason Collison and Luke Granger before you joined the team in 2020? 

No, I didn’t. I met them before lockdown early 2020. They were aware of my work creating and launching Thameen and brought me onto the team to steer the brand into a new phase of growth.

“They were aware of my work creating and launching Thameen and brought me onto the team to steer the brand into a new phase of growth.”

Who does what in the scheme of things? And what are your backgrounds?

We are a close hands-on team. Luke and Jason were previously Boadicea The Victorious, so our collective experience is niche luxury fragrance.

Luke is the founder and runs logistics, warehouse and supply side of the business and we work together on product innovation. Jason’s business development and sales, and my areas are creative direction, perfume and new product development, communications and digital.

Electimuss Box & Ribbon

Ancient Rome is rich with inspiration. Have you become a bit of a history/mythology buff in the process? 

Totally! I must confess that mythology was already one of my passions. I love exploring Greek, Nordic, Roman and Chinese mythology and seeing similar narratives and moralities pop up across different cultures throughout the centuries.

There is so much material to enjoy. Stephen Fry’s Mythos is an epic and very accessible introduction to the entirety of Greek mythology, on which most of Roman mythology was based. But there are interesting contemporary takes on the classics, like the incredibly talented Madeline Miller and Kamila Shamsie, plus great podcasts like Myths and Legends.

IMAGE: Penguin Books.

However, it isn’t just mythology, it’s also Roman history that’s so fascinating. We draw inspiration from both.

One of the things that separates Electimuss from an increasingly crowded niche sector is that all the scents are pure parfum concentration…

Yes, we’re unbending on that. Our name is a Latin portmanteau meaning “to choose the best” and that tenet runs through everything we do: the perfumers we work with, the ingredients and the concentrations.

We’re aware that luxury fragrance comes at a price, but our mission is to deliver the highest quality performance for the price. The budget on our perfumes far exceeds other brands in the same price band and with very high inclusion. So although our perfumes are not cheap, one spray goes a long way.

Electimuss Mercurial Cashmere Parfum

How did the collaborations with master perfumer Christian Provenzano (Pomona Vitalis, Persephone’s Patchouli, Capua) come about?

We’ve worked with Christian on eight of our perfumes now.

My idea for the Consort Collection was a collaborative creative approach. I wanted to work with one central note and explore it through two different lenses on a shared story.

So the story of Pluto, king of the underworld, and Persephone, daughter of the goddess of nature, was explored with patchouli representing the confluence of the underworld and earth’s surface. We worked with Christian Provenzano (pictured, below) and Kèvin Mathys for this new pair of perfumes.

IMAGE: Christian Provenzano Parfums.

Black Caviar from the Nero Collection is one of my personal favourites and very much captures what the brand is about… 

It is one of our first perfumes and one of our bestsellers. It typifies what Electimuss is good at: creating original perfumes with gravitas. Our ambition is to create modern masterpieces that will become iconic classics of the future.

Talk us through a typical briefing of one of your selected perfumers. 

It usually starts with a muse. For example, currently my muse is Venus for the next fragrance, so I explore all different aspects of Venus, from her different depictions through mythology to the way she has been represented in literature, art, music and more.

CREATIVE EXPRESSION: Sofia Bardelli created Mercurial Cashmere for Electimuss. IMAGE: Accademia del Profumo.

From there I either develop a conceptual brief around a specific ingredient (like the two patchouli perfumes launched earlier this year) or a map of scent references I’m interested in exploring, inspired by our muse.

The brief can include paintings, music, colours, stories and ingredient references. But we never want to be prescriptive – the key is creating a concept and an anchor for creative exploration.

“We never want to be prescriptive – the key is creating a concept and an anchor for creative exploration.”

Each perfumer we work with explores the brief in different ways: some like to talk, others to be more straight to creation to express their response. We then assess and evolve the fragrances together.

From the website, I see you’re about to launch a new collection. Tell us more about that please. 

Our new launch is Travel Atomisers. We are working some of our best-selling perfumes into travel size with a stunning purple and gold atomiser.

IMAGE: Electimuss.

And we are due to launch Hair Mist early ’23. With the launch of three new beautiful perfumes next year, we have been busy creating. We’re so excited about these scents.

With the brand’s luxury credentials, there’s increasing pressure to be eco-friendly too. What progress is Electimuss making on that front?

Good question and on our minds constantly. It’s tough to make real change in this business. Sustainability runs from back to front end and we are making progress. Some solutions we look at seem sustainable, such as refillables, but when you pull them apart, they actually aren’t any more sustainable. And we aren’t interested in sustainable messaging, our focus is affecting real change.

Electimuss Mercurial Cashmere Box

Our ingredients are sustainable and vegan. We offset on delivery and logistics. On the packaging side, we are currently working on innovating the interiors of our boxes, but with luxury products keeping the product safe and pristine is paramount to customer satisfaction, so it takes innovation to find the solution.

3 ELECTIMUSS FRAGRANCES TO TRY NOW

All these perfumes from the Nero Collection capture what Electimuss is about in different and delightful ways.

ELECTIMUSS BLACK CAVIAR PARFUM (MARCO GENOVESE)

To call this 2019 release “intriguing” would be a massive understatement.

Taking its inspiration from the decadence of emperors Severus and Nero, it opens with the saltiness of caviar. The savoury gourmand note is made even more appealing with a chic coolness, as if on ice. A note of animalic oud adds to the richness. There’s aromatics aplenty from notes of rosemary, sage and lavender, with the latter standing out with its fresh and spicy, almost aniseed-y facets. The woodiness of vetiver, patchouli and oakmoss is maximised in the drydown.

From start to finish, it’s delicious stuff.

Electimuss Black Caviar Parfum

ELECTIMUSS MERCURIAL CASHMERE PARFUM (SOFIA BARDELLI)

An apt name for a fragrance that changes from the light and bright to the sensual and deep.

This 2021 release starts out in fresh and spicy mode with notes of Madagascan pink pepper, cardamom and Italian bergamot. The powder of iris and violet is paired with the white floral intensity of tuberose and the slight saltiness of a note of ambergris. And what about the cashmere? In perfumery, this refers to the synthetic Cashmeran (also known as blonde woods). It’s at its musky-woody best here. There’s more sweetness (just enough) from notes of caramel, vanilla and tonka bean. I don’t pick up much of the listed oud note, but that’s just me being fussy.

Named for the Roman god Mercury, it might imply a rapid change in mood from charming to nasty, but no worries, this beauty is definitely about the former.

Electimuss Mercurial Cashmere Parfum

ELECTIMUSS VICI LEATHER PARFUM (JULIEN RASQUINET)

Julien Rasquinet is admired for his work for niche brands such as Amouage, Zoologist and Masque Milano. His first fragrance for Electimuss, a 2022 release, takes its cue from the Latin phrase “veni, vidi, vici” (“I came, I saw, I conquered”).

An elegantly cosy scene is set with the spicy and powdery warmth of cinnamon. There are subtle touches of wormwood and pink pepper in the background. A leather accord-tuberose combo gives the composition a subtly sweet animalic quality without the white floral dominating things, while the musky amber accord in the drydown maintains the comfy ambience.

*Electimuss samples, Mercurial Cashmere and Black Caviar kindly gifted to me by the brand.

The Ghost Perfumer (The Perfume Book You Should Read This Year): An Interview With Author Gabe Oppenheim

The Ghost Perfumer

Every now and then, a book comes along that changes your perspective of an industry and some of the players within it. The Ghost Perfumer: Creed, Lies, & The Scent of the Century by Gabe Oppenheim (Solicitude) is that kind of read.

The Ghost Perfumer

In a punchy and page-turning style with well-researched detail, Gabe Oppenheim gives credence to the rumours that have been swirling for years on online forums regarding Creed’s claims that the niche fragrance house has been producing fragrances since 1760 and for an impressive array of celebrities and dignitaries along the way, including King Alfonso XIII of Spain and Cary Grant.

The Ghost Perfumer - Gabe Oppenheim

But more importantly, the writer reveals how Olivier Creed, heir to the Creed clothing business, passed off many high-profile Creed releases as his own creations by taking advantage of the insecurities of a trio of perfumers.

Most of The Ghost Perfumer tells the story of Pierre Bourdon, creator of classics such as Yves Saint Laurent Kouros EDT, Davidoff Cool Water EDT, Montblanc Individuel EDT and Frédéric Malle French Lover EDP. And now acknowledged as the master behind several Creeds, including Fleurs de Bulgarie EDP, Green Irish Tweed EDP, Erolfa EDP, Millésime Impérial EDP, Silver Mountain Water EDP, Spring Flower EDP and Original Santal EDP.

And what of Creed Aventus, “the scent of the century”? Jean-Christophe Hérault gets long-last recognition for being the true talent behind this decade-defining and much-copied perfume. Julien Rasquinet also gets credit for creating Creed Royal Oud EDP and Creed Fleurs de Gardenia EDP, among others. Both these perfumers were students of Pierre Bourdon, which just adds to the intricacies and intrigues of the intertwined narratives explored by Gabe Oppenheim.

The Ghost Perfumer - Creed Aventus EDP

In what could have been a mere hatchet-job on a nasty character, Gabe Oppenheim places the behaviour of Olivier Creed and Pierre Bourdon in the context of an industry that’s built on fantasy, obfuscation and sometimes questionable business practises (for example, the rampant cloning of successful scents).

In this interview he chats about how The Ghost Perfumer come about, the workings of the industry and meeting Pierre Bourdon.

The Ghost Perfumer

You’re known as a contributor to various magazines and author of books. How was this Creed project different to your other writing projects?

In many ways, it felt very similar – when I covered boxing, there was always a narrative that promoters were trying to push about their fighters, about upcoming match-ups. This was often hype that had very little relation to the reality of the boxer’s preparation or the event itself.

And so it struck me as kind of familiar when I saw that in the scent industry, the stories told about the supposed perfumers and their inspirations were generally cant and utterly apart from the truth of how fragrance is created.

“The Ghost Perfumer was different from some of my sports coverage because there’s a degree of truth in sports that the arts just cannot provide.” 

That said, The Ghost Perfumer different from some of my sports coverage because there’s a degree of truth in sports that the arts just cannot provide. A baseball score, barring any cheating, is an objective measure of who was better on the day. A knockout is unimpeachably the triumph of one combatant over another.

And yet in fragrance, even compositions that win briefs can’t necessarily be said to be better formulas than those that lost. A scent wins in the eyes of an evaluator or creative director. Or even in a panel test. But all those judgments are subjective, and runner-up scents can end up on the market under another name and prove themselves superior to those frags they lost to in an initial brief.

Was there a particular event that sparked this project?

A lot of events. I was tired of covering combat sport, generally, and I was curious about the creators of scents. I had actually interviewed the duo behind the Imaginary Authors brand while I was still working on the fights. I wore their A City on Fire scent to Jay-Z’s office building once, back when his company was really trying to build up a boxing promotion.

IMAGE: Imaginary Authors.

But perhaps the final trigger was this zest I had for packing a new fragrance every time I travelled around the world to cover a fight. I was wearing these fascinating scents on press row in arenas the world over. And by 2019, I realised I was being somewhat myopic – why not figure out who had concocted these potions and why and what they were like beyond their laboratory orgues?

I knew there was good nonfiction to be found there, even if I didn’t yet have a clue as to what focus a book might take.

What were your thoughts on Creed fragrances before you started the book? Were you aware of the rumours about the dates of the releases and their supposed celebrity wearers?

I’d always found the celebrity claims a little preposterous. And I’d always liked the scents very much – I wore Green Irish Tweed, Bois du Portugal, Royal Oud and Aventus regularly. Over time I took a liking to Viking. I’d tried Tabarome and found it lacking as a tobacco scent.

I think the only info I had about the reality of their creation was what Michael Edwards and Luca Turin had discovered prior to my breaking into the field – that somehow Pierre Bourdon had had a hand in making Green Irish Tweed. But that was all I knew.

The Ghost Perfumer - Creed Green Irish Tweed EDP

And so I just kept trying to reach out to Bourdon, despite his self-imposed exile from Parisian perfumer society and resultant residence up in Normandy. It’s why Pierre should get so much credit for my own reportage – if he hadn’t decided one day, many months into the project, to open up to me, I may not have dug too deeply into just how Creed had ostensibly generated those aforementioned scents I so enjoyed wearing.

What were you most surprised to discover in your research?

That Pierre Bourdon’s compensation for creating Creed’s scents consisted almost entirely (if not entirely-entirely) of bespoke suits from Olivier.

“Pierre Bourdon’s compensation for creating Creed’s scents consisted almost entirely (if not entirely-entirely) of bespoke suits from Olivier.” 

What has the official Creed response been to the book since publication?

The new management team that BlackRock [the private equity fund which bought a majority stake in Creed in 2020] installed, a c-suite based in London, was so kind to me when I reached out to them pre-publication, particularly the head of marketing, Giles Gordon. We had a brief email correspondence during which Giles first offered to help me with my research and later retracted the offer, but my impression was that the company wanted to be authentic to its actual roots and not just fantasy.

The Ghost Perfumer - Creed Original Santal EDP

And whether I forced Giles’ hand or not, that assessment has been born out – Creed has published two large magazine volumes since The Ghost Perfumer’s release that update the Creed family’s tale, align it with my own – the first said Olivier began trying to make the haberdashery into a perfumery beginning with fits and starts in the 1960s and the second revised the dates to the 1970s.

Which is truthful: the Creeds were not in the business of fragrance creation before then – and until Pierre became ghost-writer in the early 1980s, Creed’s small-batch scents were insignificant efforts, secondary to tailoring, and retailed primarily in small nooks, like the perfume shop Soleil d’Or in Lille, France.

“Until Pierre became ghost-writer in the early 1980s, Creed’s small-batch scents were insignificant efforts, secondary to tailoring.” 

When I finished the book, I envisioned public smashings of Creed fragrances. But that’s just me being childish. What was your intention with it?

Oh, gosh, I had no such vision. I still own Creed scents. I had no intent except to tell a remarkable story – of a man who owned a company and desperately wanted to be a perfumer and of the diffident genius he used to unfairly snatch that mantle.

I wanted people to be fascinated by the interaction of Olivier and Pierre’s careers. A boycott of the company resembling Disco Demolition night was never a consideration for me.

The Ghost Perfumer - Creed Erolfa EDP

Olivier Creed comes across as, let’s be frank, quite predatorial and a nasty piece of work. Did you approach him for comment? And did you ever have any doubts about your characterisation of him?

I approached Creed’s North American arm early in 2020 and they wouldn’t let me speak to Olivier; tentatively, they scheduled me to talk to Erwin [his son] instead. I figured if I did pose real questions to Erwin, however, I might prove my seriousness as a journalist and earn some time with Olivier.

However, someone rather rude in the Creed North America office cancelled my Erwin email-chat last minute, and after that, no matter who I asked at Creed about talking to Olivier or getting clarification on his actual status as a “perfumer” I got no response at all.

“No matter who I asked at Creed about talking to Olivier or getting clarification on his actual status as a ‘perfumer’ I got no response at all.” 

Partly, I don’t think the company, prior to its takeover by BlackRock, believed I had the cojones or skill to depict the company’s actual workings. And after the takeover, I think those newly in charge felt the revelations were inevitable but didn’t want to hasten their release.

The book isn’t only an exposé of Creed, it also reveals the workings of the industry and its incestuous nature. How did you get people to talk to you about what really goes on behind the scenes?

I wrote long and impassioned emails about the need for perfume folks and general readers to get a better sense of who actually formulated the scents they so loved (and sometimes deplored).

It took a long time to convince perfumers – International Fragrance & Flavours didn’t okay my interviews with their folks for many, many months, before Judith Gross [Vice-President Communication & Branding, Scent], whom I love, ultimately realized I was quite serious about creative nonfiction and not just a shill or a parasite.

ALL OKAY: It took many months to get Judith Gross to approve interviews with IFF’s perfumers for research for The Ghost Perfumer. IMAGE: IFF.

And once I had access, I just pressed the perfumers to tell me what they were like, how they had gotten into the business, what they did in their free time. I wanted them to know I saw them as full humans, as artisans of the highest order whose stories could hold as much fascination as painters’ or musicians’ or boxers’.

Still, there are perfumers whose entourages still never let me get close enough to prove any of that – [Jacques] Cavallier, [Alberto] Morillas, [Michel] Almairac. Those are perhaps the top three who didn’t care for such an examination by this American interloper (or maybe Almairac’s son Benjamin never even put the request to his Pops – dunno quite why that never came together).

The part where you meet Pierre Bourdon at his home is particularly touching. Although he was certainly exploited by Oliver Creed, you’re careful not to paint him as a hapless victim…

Bourdon doesn’t view himself as a victim, really. The man got to practice an art whose ideas and concepts he treasures. Maybe he always detested some of the business practices. But the man took his love of Proust and applied the author’s passion for creation – for showing the work of creation in the creation itself – to perfumery. What could have satisfied such a scholarly and thoughtful reader more?

The Ghost Perfumer - Meeting Pierre Bourdon

NORMANDY RENDEZVOUS: Pierre Bourdon in the second Cabinet of Curiosities Room in his home. IMAGE: THE GHOST PERFUMER.

How did you earn Pierre Bourdon’s trust to get him to reveal so much to you?

Through many emails sent to the address he shared with his wife, Kathy, who always seemed to think me a decent sort – but really, through the imploring of Jean-Claude Ellena, who convinced Pierre first that I was serious about my own craft, writing, and could perhaps do justice to Pierre’s.

Let’s talk about Jean-Christophe Hérault and his role in the creation of the mega-hit Creed Aventus. He was very forthcoming at first and then the shutters came down. Why the change in behaviour?

Probably a sense that he had revealed enough to hurt his career and didn’t want to exacerbate things further – I say, probably, because Hérault might dismiss that without offering a better answer.

Gabe Oppenheim - Jean-Christophe Hérault

Regardless, he seems glad now that The Ghost Perfumer was written, that he’s being credited finally with the massive success he engineered. We text each other every now and again, and we’re certainly on friendly terms, for which I’m grateful. He has a signed copy of the book, and I own a good deal of his fragrant output. He has been nothing but kind to me of late.

I don’t blame him for not quite getting at first that my intentions, in terms of attributing work to its rightful creators, were more pure than not, and that I had the gumption to follow this process through to the end.

The Ghost Perfumer - Creed Aventus EDP

You also delve into the Julien Rasquinet creations that were passed off as Olivier Creed’s. Did he actually create any of the other Creed releases that are attributed to him on sites such as Fragrantica?

Olivier was a great creative director – he knew what sort of scent would beguile men (or, at least, he picked up in the 1960s and 1970s these notions). So Olivier can be credited with choosing the best scents, mostly, of those perfumers who did the actual technical work.

Olivier, however, not doing that technical work, cannot fairly be called a perfumer-creator, the definition of which perfumers such as [Christophe] Laudamiel and Calice Becker make rather clear not infrequently. I admire their devotion to getting the bylines in this messy industry cleaned up.

The Ghost Perfumer - Julien Rasquinet

The subtitle of the book is Part 1: Creed, Lies, & The Scent of the Century. What’s the next one about?

The next one could involve a certain Berlin-based perfumer who’s a masterful raconteur and a well-known figure to the fragcomm. But it could also be about the pirates of the Dubai clone market or the bizarre way in which Caron has survived several strange owners (it’s now a property of a Rothschild).

Or perhaps it will be about none of these things. I’ve made a good many false starts in the last few months. But they aren’t all for naught – at least one will hopefully become a full-length book.

IMAGE: Caron.

And I would tell perfume-prose fans, if you like my nonfiction, I think you’ll like my inventions, too – and in fact, I’ve been working also on a novel and perhaps that will come out in between perfume-focused books, first. I’ve written about 4 000 compelling words so far for that project. Maybe I’ll never see it to the end, but for now, I’m just thinking, 96 000 equally satisfying words to go…

The Ghost Perfumer: Creed, Lies, & The Scent of the Century is available worldwide on Amazon.

Gabe Oppenheim - The Ghost Perfumer Cover

Benoît Verdier Interview: “It Was A Bit Of Us Against The World When We Founded Ex Nihilo”

Benoît Verdier

IMAGE: Ex Nihilo.

When three Parisians with an impressive array of skills and backgrounds – Sylvie Loday, Olivier Royère and Benoît Verdier – got together to start their own company in 2013, there was no guarantee of realising their ambitions. Especially in the ruthlessly competitive and ever-growing niche perfume sector. Nine years later, the trio can justifiably be proud of the success story that is Ex Nihilo.

Benoît Verdier

EX NIHILO FOUNDERS: Benoît Verdier, Olivier Royère and Sylvie Loday. IMAGE: Ex Nihilo.

While decidedly French, their approach has a rebellious aspect too. The result? Impactful fragrances that are high on memorability and that put the expertise of the perfumers with which they collaborate (for example, Quentin Bisch, Natalie Gracia-Cetto and Jordi Fernández) in the spotlight.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Outcast Blue EDP

Although the three share certain roles, Provence-born Benoît Verdier has become the public face of the brand. I got to meet him on a visit to South Africa earlier this year when he was touring the stores of the Ex Nihilo distribution partner in the country, Skins Cosmetics, and to launch the house’s latest release, Outcast Blue.

Despite his tight schedule and repeatedly answering the same questions, Benoît Verdier was exuberant and clearly in his element talking about all things Ex Nihilo (and the wider industry). As I wanted to interview him in more detail, we connected again over Zoom a few months later and chatted about risky business, sustainability and new projects.

Benoît Verdier - Skins Cosmetics Johannesburg

What have you been up to since we last met in Johannesburg?

We are in Paris and will start to travel a lot from October. We opened a new flagship store in Taipei and in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, and Doha, Qatar, just before the FIFA World Cup. So quite a lot to do.

IMAGE: Ex Nihilo.

How did the three of you come together to found Ex Nihilo?

It’s quite a simple story. I studied with Olivier back in the day and we always wanted to create our own company. He was really passionate about fragrances and his grandfather was working in luxury already. His father was a diplomat so he was travelling the world. And he’s also my best friend.

BEST FRAGRANCE FRIEND: Olivier Royère and Benoît Verdier studied together. IMAGE: Ex Nihilo.

After our studies, we began working with various companies. Olivier started in L’Oréal as an intern and I was consulting for brands for marketing and luxury stuff, a lot of fragrances. In 2013, we decided it was the moment after our experiences to create the company. And we met Sylvie who was working for Givaudan [the Swiss fragrance and flavour company]. It was quite organic because I used to work with a lot of beauty brands from L’Oréal, Coty, LVMH, etc. Olivier had a background in finance.

GIVAUDAN CONNECTION: Sylvie Loday is one of the co-founders of the brand. IMAGE: Ex Nihilo.

And we decided to start from scratch. That’s why we chose the name “Ex Nihilo” [Latin for from or out of nothing] because when you start a new company, you also have the option to buy an old company and to market it and invent storytelling and narratives. But we wanted to start from nothing and create the brand of our dreams with inspiration from every field.

When we started, it was only the three of us plus one person for the production and a trainee for the design. So it was a bit of us against the world and nobody really believed in us [laughs].

Congrats, that means you’re heading for your 10th year in 2023…

Thank you, it’s a long and short story at the same time. We are expanding fairly fast. Our first flagship store in Paris was a risky strategy according to the rent and several other factors. But we said there are so many brands, we have to make a statement, do something different, we have to impress.

“We have to make a statement, do something different, we have to impress” – Benoît Verdier 

It was a good strategy because we gained credibility, attracted the customers and beauty editors – Instagram was not so big then – and potential distributors.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Atlas Fever EDP

Thanks to Fleur Narcotique by Quentin Bisch and The Osmologue [the brand’s innovative personalisation device, only available in flagship stores], we managed to have a great commercial success, so we could continue to grow. But honestly at the beginning it was risky. It looked very romantic, very Parisian, but when you haven’t been paid for a year…

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Fleur Narcotique EDP

How many people work for the brand now?

Everything is based in Paris where I am currently. At the beginning we were only four and used to work with agencies to out-source things like digital.

We decided to bring everything back in-house. There are 28 of us in Paris, perhaps 30 with interns, for marketing, communications, social media, graphic design, merchandising, packaging design, architecture and, of course, the products.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo The Hedonist EDP

It’s a different configuration to what we started out with. In terms of business, it’s something you can manage better and to be true to what we do, we don’t have to explain ourselves to agencies and there’s more creativity. So we’re working like a little start-up.

Going back to the three of you, who does what?

We try to share. For creation in general, it’s more myself. I share the olfactory creation with Sylvie, as she has the background with Givaudan. Olivier is part of that, but also more the finances, HR and business aspects. Sylvie is more in charge of commercial development, the opening of new stores and corners.

Benoît Verdier - Skins Cosmetics Johannesburg

You seem to be the public face of the brand. Was that planned?

It just happened. As we travel like crazy, we had to split the roles and as I’m in charge of communications and social media, I’m representing [the brand]. We try to share as far as we can, but it’s more my part.

“With Kilian [Hennessy] or Francis [Kurkdjian], it’s rare to see them. So we have an opportunity to be more accessible and spread the passion.” – Benoît Verdier

When I travel, I try to maximise by seeing our clients, our distributors, train our teams. It’s super important to be in the field. With Kilian [Hennessy] or Francis [Kurkdjian], it’s rare to see them, because they are superstars in a way. So we have an opportunity to be more accessible and spread the passion. Otherwise, we are just like other brands and people like that difference.

Benoît Verdier - Skins Cosmetics Johannesburg

REPRESENTING: Benoît Verdier at Skins Cosmetics, Johannesburg.

Let’s talk more about the fragrances specifically. Is there a molecule in common with all the Ex Nihilo fragrances? For example, I’m wearing Iris Porcelana, Midnight Special and Cologne 352. They’re very different, but there seems to be something in common…

You’re pointing out something interesting there. As we are working with so many different characters, perfumers, it is super difficult to keep that red line, or the blue line with Ex Nihilo [the brand’s colour]. So we spend a lot of time thinking about the collection and how we keep our olfactory identity.

There is no common ingredient, but we brief the perfumers the same way. We want something addictive, welcoming, immediate… we love the texture of materials. We want people to smell them.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Cologne 352 EDP

I would say the only common point is the white musks we use when we see all our creations in a big panorama. For the florals to upgrade the bloom and sillage, for the orientals to give comfort and to melt on the skin…

It’s unusual that you haven’t discontinued any fragrances…

Because we are also customers. We know how frustrating that is. So we decided even if only a few people love a fragrance, we will keep it. If you can’t find it on shelf, because of distribution, you’ll find it on the website and we’ll send it directly to your home.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Vetiver Moloko EDP

For example, French Affair by Quentin Bisch is not the most commercial and doesn’t sell like crazy. I love it personally and it’s part of our story.

You’ve recently gone the extrait de parfum route with Fleur Narcotique and Outcast Blue. What was the thinking behind that?

Maybe it’s the answer to things becoming too mainstream, so we try to push the creations to something even more exclusive and using higher concentrations of ingredients. It’s part of the strategy to push to the top.

It was not opportunistic in that sense. Both scents were perfect for it. It was a bit of an exercise in style to see what we can do.

In the portfolio we are also preparing new very concentrated oils for layering. We are also working on exceptional pieces that you can collect, only one fragrance made. Today, the focus is more on the top of the range.

IMAGE: Ex Nihilo.

And what about sustainability?

That’s essential. How to be super-luxury and using new Givaudan biotech ingredients. And to be more impressive with the packaging with no plastic and something that would surprise you.

When you see our packaging, it was already in our mind to use this kind of recycled foam to protect the fragrance from the sharks, the heat and the differences in temperature. It was a bit of a plastic garbage before and then it was transformed into a beautiful box, which you can use for a third time – it’s registered powder – in the industry.

The next development is how can we do the same with organic ingredients or even organic waste. But it’s tricky because if you communicate about something coming from waste, you have to convince people it’s worth it.

“If you communicate about something coming from waste, you have to convince people it’s worth it” – Benoît Verdier

For customers, there’s a lot of education, explaining why. In some markets, they’re chasing limited editions, something expensive, something flashy, but they’re not too concerned about ecology. Maybe in the US, UK, northern Europe, yes, France a bit. But in other parts of the world, it’s not such a priority. So we would like to make ecology sexy back [laughs] and desirable, but also luxurious.

For this year’s release, Iris Porcelana, you used a relatively unknown perfumer, Dalia Izem. How did that collaboration come about?

The Initiale Collection is inspired by the most iconic raw ingredients and we’ve been wanting to do an iris fragrance for a long time.

Dalia’s been living in Dubai and she told us she’d be very interested to work with us for the first time. She had many ideas about iris pallida from Tuscany. As you know, it’s an expensive ingredient, which takes about three years to grow, another three years to dry and then the processing of it.

Benoît Verdier - Dalia Izem

IMAGE: Givaudan.

We wanted to avoid the roughness, what you’d smell in a wet garden. On the contrary, we wanted to bring it to something more milky, powdery. She worked on it for about six to seven months. Originally, we were thinking something more classic like iris and leather, but decided to go for something softer, more enveloping and muskier to highlight the iris.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Iris Porcelana EDP

We’ve all smelt many iris fragrances over the years. This release is definitely iris, but distinctive in its own way with that Ex Nihilo touch. Well done!

Thank you. You must also discover our new one, Santal Calling, which we’ve just launched. It’s our interpretation of sandalwood album from Australia, with a milky accord on top and a bit of vanilla bourbon from Madagascar. It was created by Antoine Maisondieu.

IMAGE: Ex Nihilo.

Sounds fantastic. Love the name. Ex Nihilo fragrances always have sexy names. They’re provocative, catchy and memorable.

It’s not 50% of the game, but you have to make a statement, make people react. I have an app on my iPhone with all the names I can find. It can come from a song, pictures from an editorial in a magazine, a movie. I try to make an association that will also make sense with what we create.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Sweet Morphine EDP

There’s two ways to create a fragrance. It can start from the name, an idea we’d like to reflect in the smell. Or it can come directly from a crazy ingredient and then I try to find what could be the story around it.

Normally, when we brief the perfumer, we already have the name. It’s then easier for them to project into a universe. For Santal Calling, it was a lot about the Brancusi Scooter in Paris, very rough, very crafted, very abstract.

We give mood boards, pictures, everything, then the perfumer has the stories, the universe, the name and can work on the fragrance.

Benoît Verdier - Ex Nihilo Gold Immortals EDP

 

 

Fabrice Pellegrin Interview: “The Perfumer’s Role Is About Being Generous, Exchanging, Sharing And Transmitting Passion. Nothing More”

Fabrice Pellegrin

IMAGE: Firmenich.

Fabrice Pellegrin is one of the most accomplished perfumers of our time. Considering his expertise and achievements, he’s probably also the most unknown outside the industry, in that he truly prefers to be behind the scenes and let his creations speak for themselves.

Fabrice Pellegrin

IMAGE: Firmenich.

The list below of perfumes Fabrice Pellegrin has produced is just a snapshot but will give you an indication of his ingenuity:

+ Mugler Womanity EDP (2010)

+ Jo Malone Blackberry & Bay Cologne (2012)

+ Roberto Cavalli Just Cavalli EDT (2013)

+ Parfums de Marly Safanad EDP (2013)

+ Salvatore Ferragamo Vendemmia EDP (2013)

+ Kilian Smoke For The Soul EDP (2014)

+ Maison Martin Margiela Tea Escape EDT (2014)

+ Valentino Valentina Pink EDP (2015)

+ Atkinson’s Love In Idleness EDP (2015)

+ Lalique L’Insoumis EDT (2016)

+ Azzaro Wanted EDT (2016)

+ Giorgio Armani Privé Vert Malachite EDP (2016)

+ Lancôme Oud Bouquet EDP (2016)

+ Van Cleef & Arpels Bois Doré EDP (2017)

+ Issey Miyake L’Eau de Majeure d’Issey EDT (2017)

+ L’Artisan Parfumeur Au Bord de L’Eau Eau de Cologne (2017)

+ Penhaligon’s Belgravia Chypre EDP (2018)

+ Moschino Toy 2 EDP (2018)

+ Kenzo Flower by Kenzo Eau de Vie EDP (2019)

+ Bentley Momentum Unbreakable EDP (2021)

Fabrice Pellegrin - Kenzo Flower by Kenzo Eau de Vie EDP

Born in the spiritual heartland of French perfumery, Grasse, and from a family immersed in the industry, Fabrice Pellegrin paid his dues over several years.

His fine fragrance career commenced with Mäurer & Wirtz Eruption Man EDT in 1997, followed by perfume projects for brands such as Hermès and L’Occitane.

He’s also the man behind several Diptyque classics. His 2005 creation for the Paris-based niche brand, Do Son EDT, signalled he was a major talent to watch and was followed by Eau Duelle EDT (2010), Volutes EDT (2012), Eau Rose EDT (2012) and Oud Palao EDP (2012), among others.

Fabrice Pellegin - Diptyque Oud Palao EDP

So it’s no surprise Fabrice Pellegrin was awarded the 14th François Coty Prize by his peers in 2021. This prestigious accolade recognised his creative and technical expertise, which reflects his love of naturals. He also bagged Cosmétique Mag’s Perfumer of the Year 2017 and his creation for Roos & Roos, Mentha Religiosa EDP, won the Fragrance Foundation’s best independent perfume award in 2017.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Bentley Momentum Unbreakable EDP

It took several months for this interview to come together and although conducted via email, the Frenchman’s sincerity and humility are evident throughout in his thoughtful answers. He talks about the role of the perfumer, the beauty of simplicity and why naturals are such an integral part of his life.

IMAGE: Firmenich.

Congratulations for your 14th François Coty Prize. It’s not the first time you’ve been recognised for your skills. Do awards matter to you?

Receiving an award is always an honour and, of course, a pleasure. However, being rewarded by the public is far more important. When you compose a fragrance, you don’t think about what you’ll get in return, you think mainly about the pleasure you have in creating it.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Diptyque Florabellio EDT

How did your family background influence you to become a perfumer?

I was born in the hills around Grasse, my home and heart town, and where my family and my vocation come from. I am the son of a perfumer and the grandson of a jasmine-picking grandmother, and a grandfather who was a supplier of naturals.

IMAGE: Firmenich.

I have a very personal relationship with the flowers of Grasse. Rose centifolia and jasmine grandiflorum are two wonderful flowers I’ve always lived with, and they are essential to me today.

Where did you study? And what do you remember most?

I did all my studies in Grasse. I learned the job of being a perfumer at Robertet. There is no better education than learning on the job. The direct contact with professionals allows you to discover all their little secrets I would not have known otherwise.

Fabrice Pellegrin

GREAT LOVE: Fabrice Pellegrin with rose centifolia. IMAGE: Firmenich.

Tell us a bit about your fragrance debut. 

From 1989 to 1995, I concentrated on my classes, learning raw materials, chromatography, distillation, extraction and weighing. From 1995 to 2008, I was with Mane as a junior perfumer. I worked on shampoos, shower gels and soaps, which helped me develop a certain kind of technicality.

And then I won my first fine fragrance project, for Mäurer & Wirtz Eruption Man EDT. I owe this first success to the brand’s chief perfumer, Gerrit van Logchem, who gave me my chance. In 2008, I joined Firmenich, and I am still here today.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Mäurer & Wirtz Eruption Man EDT

IMAGE: Mäurer & Wirtz.

Compared to some “celebrity” perfumers, you seem to be more content keeping a low profile. Is that a correct assessment?

People often say I’m discreet. For me, the perfumer’s role is about being generous, exchanging, sharing and transmitting passion. Nothing more.

You’re Director of Natural Product Innovation at Firmenich. What does that position entail and why are you particularly fond of naturals?

I am from Grasse so, of course, I learned the art of perfume through natural products. Perfumers have always been used to working with natural ingredients, which bring richness and opulence to their creations. Beyond their purely olfactory qualities, natural ingredients also bring stories to perfumes and reinforce their poetic dimension.

“Beyond their purely olfactory qualities, natural ingredients also bring stories to perfumes and reinforce their poetic dimension” – Fabrice Pellegrin

I very much enjoy collaborating with local producers in Grasse and in other parts of the world. Through their savoir-faire, they allow us to offer the epitome of nature. My role as Director of Natural Product Innovation enables me to travel and meet our producers, for whom I have infinite respect in the creation process.

IMAGE: Firmenich.

In my role, I also work directly with our teams in Grasse on new techniques and processes. One good example of our innovation capabilities is our FirGood: a new process that allows a solvent-free treatment of fresh biomass, never before used in the natural ingredients industry. Its 100% natural extracts offer new olfactory signatures, such as FirGood pear, ginger or lily of the valley.

Another example is with the technique called Nature Print. In the latest Paco Rabanne fragrance, Fame – which I contributed to, alongside my colleague perfumers Dora Baghriche, Marie Salamagne and Alberto Morillas – we incorporated a Sicilian mango that has been processed in Grasse, using this technique. We captured the scents of the mango and the mango leaf, analysed them and reproduced them as close as possible to their original scent, using only natural ingredients.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Paco Rabanne Fame EDP

IMAGE: Paco Rabanne.

With your passion for naturals, what are your thoughts on synthetics?

The basis of my creation is natural, but I also use synthesis to facet the natural, to enrich it, to give it a new hue. Synthetic molecules allow me to create an opening towards new olfactory territories.

Synthesis is directly inspired by natural scents (rose, jasmine, etc). Chemistry does not invent anything; it only reproduces what already exists in nature. We must stop believing that natural and synthetic are opposed, when the subject is precisely how they balance each other in a formula.

“We must stop believing that natural and synthetic are opposed, when the subject is how they balance each other in a formula” – Fabrice Pellegrin

I am also a firm believer in the immense value of biotech products, such as Firmenich Clearwood or Dreamwood, which are derived from the fermentation of natural sugars. This union of science and nature to transform sugar into patchouli or sandalwood notes is truly fascinating.

BIOTECH VALUE: Fabrice Pellegrin used the Firmenich captive molecule Dreamwood in the creation of Bentley Momentum Unbreakable EDP. IMAGE: Firmenich.

Which perfume project did you find particularly challenging?

In fact, all projects are a challenge.

Jean Paul Gaultier Scandal EDP [2017] is one I remember well. The project lasted five years and required a lot of resilience and stamina. We started developing it with one company, BPI, then continued with Puig when they bought the brand.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Jean Paul Gaultier So Scandal! EDP

Another instance was Jo Malone Nashi Blossom Cologne [2016], because in perfumes, nashi blossom notes have often been worked in facets, rather than as the main olfactive idea. As a perfumer, I was inspired by this task to tell the story of this unique fruit. Exploring the whole ingredient, from fruit to petal to tree, was indeed a challenge.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Jo Malone Nashi Blossom Cologne

IMAGE: Jo Malone.

More recently, for Penhaligon’s The World According to Arthur EDP [2021], my challenge was to create a magnificent incense scent. To do that, I selected different qualities of incense. I was searching to obtain the most fresh, resinous and dazzling facet. In total, I selected three types of incense, whose olfactive profiles are complementary. Then I was able to unify the different treatments to create a scent that was coherent with my initial idea.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Penhaligon's The World According to Arthur EDP

IMAGE: Penhaligon’s.

Which perfume do you admire the most?

I have a strong admiration for Serge Lutens Féminité du Bois EDP. I love its structure – a very short, yet precise formula – the fact that it’s so recognizable and that it’s without a gender. We’re celebrating its 30th anniversary this year.

FABRICE PELLEGRIN FAVOURITE: The perfumer loves the preciseness and immediate recognisability of Serge Lutens Féminité du Bois EDP. IMAGE: Serge Lutens.

I also adore Miracle from Lancôme. Alberto [Morillas] knows how to work around musks in a sublime way. Among my favourites are also [Issey Miyake] L’Eau d’Issey, man and woman, [Davidoff] Cool Water and [Dior] Fahrenheit for their simplicity and singularity.

Roos & Roos Mentha Religiosa EDP is one of my favourite creations of yours. In what ways is it typical of your style?

Mints have interesting olfactory asperities. I like to use them as they come up as quite unexpected in fine fragrance creation, for instance in Eau de Minthé for Diptyque.

In Mentha Religiosa, I used a fresh and intense mint, accompanied by a dark incense blended with patchouli and vanilla. Both are two difficult notes to work with; mint being often associated with technical perfumery for oral care, and quite antagonistic. The equilibrium of this perfume lies in the unexpected combination between the tiny green leaf with a powdery, ambery drydown.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Roos & Roos Mentha Religiosa EDP

This is typical of my style in that I’m convinced there is beauty to be found in the simplest of ideas. In my fragrances I often try to create with simplicity – I always say that designing something simple is in fact very complex! What I like the most is crafting simple, direct fragrances that are well architectured.

“What I like the most is crafting simple, direct fragrances that are well architectured” – Fabrice Pellegrin 

For each perfume I create, I start with a raw idea, then I work on it for months, sometimes even years, to make it totally appealing.

One of your recent creations is the EDP version of the classic Diptyque Eau Rose. Apart from its concentration, what makes this release different from the original?

It is a more intense version, richer, in the generosity that this rose has and in the fruity elements, with accents of lychee, which give addiction to the perfume.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Diptyque Eau Rose EDT

It is also a soliflore but enhanced with woody, ambery, enveloping notes. I used an innovation, the FIRAD rose, because it brings a different patina to the products we have on the palette. This is one of the first times I have used it in a perfume.

Second, the olfactory profile. The FIRAD rose is upcycled because it comes from the distillation water of the rose that we recover and concentrate to keep only the aromatic molecules that remain in the water. It is less heavy, syrupy and fresher, fruitier. This freshness, this fruity tone brings a smile to the fragrance. This unique and responsible process is one that we master and develop in our laboratories in Grasse.

Fabrice Pellegrin - Diptyque Eau Rose EDT + Diptyque Eau Rose EDP

DIPTYQUE DUO: Fabrice Pellegrin created Eau Rose EDT and Eau Rose EDP for the Paris-based niche brand.

Does work dominate your life, or is there time for yourself?

Work is predominant in my life, but there’s time for my family, for sure. I live between two cities, Paris and Grasse, because this is the right balance for myself.

I use the time I have to transmit my knowledge, because I’m interested to know that future generations will continue this savoir-faire. Whenever I can, I talk to perfumery students.

I also have the privilege of sharing my passion with my sons, Florian and Romain, both set to become perfumers.

IMAGE: Firmenich.

Nathalie Feisthauer Interview: The Diversity Of Independence

Nathalie Feisthauer

Some people you don’t even have to meet to get a sense of them. Nathalie Feisthauer is one of those individuals. And I use the word “individual” purposefully because the 30-year+ career of the Paris-based master perfumer has been defined by unconventionality.

Nathalie Feisthauer

From her education at Roure Bertrand Dupont (now the Givaudan Perfumery School) to creations for prestigious brands such as Cartier, Comme des Garçons, Hermès and Etat Libre d’Orange (see below for more), the perfume path of Nathalie Feisthauer has been one of not following the norm.

  • Aramis Havana EDT (1994)
  • Versace Blonde EDT (1995)
  • Pierre Balmain Vent Vert EDT (1999)
  • Cartier Must de Cartier Pour Homme EDT (2000)
  • Oriflame Giordani Gold Original EDP (2002)
  • Yves Saint Laurent Kouros Tattoo EDT (2007)
  • Lancôme Hypnôse Senses EDP (2009)
  • Amouage Honour Man EDP (2011)
  • Ferrari Essence Oud EDP (2012)
  • Etat Libre d’Orange Putain des Palaces EDP (2013)
  • Van Cleef & Arpels Rêve EDP (2013)
  • Comme des Garçons Blue Cedrat EDP (2013)
  • Carolina Herrera Oud Couture EDP (2015)
  • Aedes de Venustas Pélargonium EDP (2017)
  • MDCI Parfums Cuir Cavalier EDP (2019)
  • Nomenclature Fluoral EDP (2019)
  • Puredistance No. 12 Perfume (2021)

After working for major fragrance companies such as Givaudan (1983-2008) and Symrise (2008-2014), her strong streak of independence found expression in the formation of her own company, LAB-Scent. Nathalie Feisthauer now focuses on producing idiosyncratic perfumes for niche brands such as A-chromiq, Alendor, Burdin and Maison Rebatchi.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Aramis Havana EDT

IMAGE: Aramis.

I also get the impression she’s quite playful when she answers one last question at the start of her three-week vacation on the Italian island of Ischia. When I say somewhat jealously, “What an inspiring place to be”, she replies, “Totally, beautiful, farniente [Italian for “doing nothing”], pool, sea…”

Nathalie Feisthauer - Cartier Pasha de Cartier Edition Noire EDT

In this interview, we chat about the influence of YSL Opium, company codes and the benefits of going independent.

What fragrance are you wearing today?

I’m wearing my new creations, some of which will soon be launched on the market.

The decision to become a perfumer is often an accumulation of events. Anything that stands out for you?

The discovery of Opium by Yves Saint Laurent was a life-changing revelation for me. It was the moment I understood my vocation.

IMAGE: Yves Saint Laurent.

When you started studying perfumery at Roure in 1983, it was unusual not to come from a perfumery family. Did that different background make it more challenging for you?

Yes, it was challenging and even more magical and new for me because I didn’t come from Grasse, and I wasn’t used to seeing and smelling all these beautiful raw materials. So it was like heaven when I arrived at the school. At the same time, it allowed me to understand the codes of companies and their functioning.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Oriflame Giordani Gold Original EDP

IMAGE: Oriflame.

What was your fine fragrance debut? What are your thoughts on it now?

My first fine fragrance was Elysium for Clarins [released in 1993], a floral-fruity fragrance for women. I composed it in New York at the age of 26, and it was a dream coming true. It was, and still is, an original fragrance, of which I am very proud.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Clarins Elysium EDT

HAPPY PLACE: Clarins Elysium EDT was Nathalie Feisthauer’s fine fragrance debut in 1993. IMAGE: Cleopatra’s Boudoir.

How do you approach each new perfume project?

I read the brief, taking the time to see what it evokes to me, whether it is images, landscapes, smells, or textures. Then I begin to formulate and smell my tests before refining them step by step. I propose tests according to the brief, but also “diagonals”, meaning smells not requested but resulting from instantaneous inspiration.

“I propose tests according to the brief, but also ‘diagonals’, meaning smells not requested but resulting from instantaneous inspiration.” – Nathalie Feisthauer 

Nathalie Feisthauer - Amouage Honour Man EDP

Your creations show an incredible range of versatility. Was that deliberate?

Yes, I like to diversify my creations and propose original perfumes, different from those offered on the current market. Nowadays, consumers are asking to stand out from the crowd and want to wear innovative, original, never-smelled perfumes. This is what I propose to them through my creations.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Comme des Garcons Blue Cedrat EDP

IMAGE: Comme des Garçons.

I have many favourite creations of yours. But let’s focus on one in particular: Hermès Eau deS Merveilles from 2004. What was unusual about its creation?

I created it with Ralf Schwieger, and its particularity is that it was created around ambergris, an animal note embellished by other woody, hesperidised, spicy and musky notes.

It was a very innovative perfume at the time. Through it, I paid tribute to Véronique Gautier, the artistic director of Hermès who had the courage to launch this fragrance.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Hermès Eau des Merveilles

How did you approach the creation of Van Cleef & Arpels Gardénia Pétale EDP (2009) in terms of using synthetics and naturals?

I wanted to capture the aerial, humid and tropical facets of this majestic flower. The real gardenia scent is heavy. I worked more on the texture of the petals. In this fragrance, there is no gardenia natural oil.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Van Cleef & Arpels Gardenia Petale EDP

When did you decide to go independent? What was your thinking behind that decision?

I created LAB-Scent eight years ago, after working for 30 years in corporate companies that trained me a lot and allowed me to become a professional perfumer.

Becoming independent was an aspiration for personal fulfilment. It allows me to be self-employed, to make a name for myself thanks to my creations, and to propose original fragrances. Furthermore, I like the relationship it creates with brand art directors that I didn’t have before.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Aedes de Venustas Pelargonium EDP

Why do you prefer to focus on niche brands now?

The niche market is less codified and allows much more creativity. Some customers ask for very original perfumes and from the four corners of the world.

I like this diversity, this freedom of creation, the possibility of using more prestigious materials and claiming them, which mass perfumery doesn’t do, and having discussions from a creative point of view.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Puredistance No 12 Perfume

IMAGE: Puredistance.

I’m loving your 2021 creation for Maison Crivelli, Lys Sølaberg. Was it easy to translate Thibaud Crivelli’s experience into olfactory reality?

Thibaud Crivelli is a man with a thirst for adventure who has travelled extensively and loves nature in its raw state.

Working on this fragrance, I interpreted his memory of the Faroe Islands, Denmark. I wanted to transcribe their remarkable beauty, with the sun shimmering on the sea, the sweet and smoky aspect of the lilies, the power of the wind, the mineral stone, and the darker, more humid aspect of the peat. I wanted to convey the idea of mankind faced with rugged nature.

“It evolves towards a note that evokes the power of the elements, which is almost telluric, and not at all fragile.” – Nathalie Feisthauer 

And so, there is a real duality in this creation. It opens with a beautiful pearlescent light, then evolves towards a note that evokes the power of the elements, which is almost telluric, and not at all fragile.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Maison Crivelli Lys Solaberg Extrait de Parfum

It develops with contrasts between the smoky, spicy lily facet, the radiant, slightly alcoholised quince, and a peaty/woody facet provided by the amber woods and an overdose of Ambroxan, as well as an absolute of roasted oak shavings, which adds an incredibly sensual patina to the accord, evoking the thatched roof houses typical of the region.

I haven’t tried it yet, but Zoologist Cow, which was released this year, sounds wonderful. Tell us a bit more about it.

Zoologist perfumes are fascinated by animals. They capture their particularities and transforms them into unusual, beautiful, funny, even shocking perfumes.

Cow is a green-floral fragrance with an apple and sage head; a milky, heliotropic and floral heart; and amber-woody-musky base notes. It evokes a green pasture with peaceful cows.

Nathalie Feisthauer - Zoologist Cow Extrait de Parfum

It’s an original perfume you’ll either love or hate. You must try it on your skin to see if you like it or not. If you do, it is soft and addictive and could become your perfume for life.

When you’re not creating perfumes, what will we find you doing?

I enjoy travelling, cooking and spending time with my kids. They make me discover new smells and flavours and stimulate my creativity. I also love being in my garden in Montmartre.

Nathalie Feisthauer

 

 

Interview With Steyn Grobler, Founder of Aqualis: “I’ve Learned To Be Very Collaborative With People”

Steyn Grobler - Aqualis

I love discovering brands that have something different to offer. Even better if they have a South African connection. Both of which Aqualis has in abundance. The London-based niche company was founded by Steyn Grobler in 2015 (he left the country at the age of 15).

BEHIND THE SCREENS: Steyn Grobler getting ready for his presentation at the Skins Cosmetics store in Johannesburg.

The 36-year-old has put his master’s in business economics and luxury perfumes experience – including head of production and business development at Boadicea The Victorious and sales director for Ex Nihilo – to effective use.

Steyn Grobler was in South Africa in February to promote Aqualis at the various Skins Cosmetics stores. We didn’t get a chance to chat properly then, so did the Zoom thing a few months later in which we covered everything from niche inspiration to his DIY ethos.

Steyn Grobler - Aqualis Display

What fragrance are you wearing today?

I’m wearing a fragrance that I’m testing. Generally, when I’m wearing a fragrance it’s something that’s been made for me.

It’s got this blackcurrant and bergamot top note, then this incredibly beautiful amber, patchouli base. It’s not quite ready yet. It hasn’t got the depth and character it needs in the base. So I’m going to be briefing the perfumer later today to give him my feedback.

If your question is what kind of perfumes I like to wear… I’m a big lover of gourmands, fresh fragrances and heavy ambers. Hate fougères. Just can’t gel with them. Floral fragrances are something to be appreciated but, yeah, not something I would wear.

Over the course of my wearing life, I’ve worn everything from cK One and Boss in Motion, then upgraded to niche brands like Roja Dove and Byredo. So stuff across the spectrum.

IMAGE: Calvin Klein.

Are those tastes reflected in the perfumes for Aqualis?

Definitely! I must really love what I put forward. Particularly when it comes to the florals, which might not be something I wear personally. That’s the kind of thing I will give to other people to smell and to smell on them. If I love it on someone else, then I will move forward with it.

There’s nothing in my collection that I haven’t extensively tested and pondered over for an incredibly long time. It’s always very well measured and tested by the time it goes to market.

Steyn Grobler - Aqualis Canvas Parfum

WORK OF ART: A shot of bergamot freshness in Aqualis Canvas Parfum leads the way to a bouquet of powdery prettiness (notes of freesia, iris, mimosa, rose), with wafts of white musk keeping it sensual and sophisticated. Created by Amandine Galliano.

How have you ensured Aqualis stands out in such a busy niche market?

There’s this super-luxury end where prices are over £400 pounds for a 50ml bottle. So I felt there was a gap for a premium product that’s not outrageously priced out of the market. The brand sits very neatly in its own little niche in the niche industry. Very few other people are doing 30% concentrations of the best quality ingredients at that price point.

Steyn Grobler - Aqualis Display

Which niche brands inspire you?

I’m always looking at other brands. Thibaud Crivelli is doing a great job with Maison Crivelli. He’s got this great attention to detail from the blotters to creating a feeling around a fragrance. Which is what I try to do, as well, I just don’t have his budget [laughs].

At the high end, Henry Jacques is an incredibly company. One which I had the pleasure of working for briefly. The quality is unmatched, their own perfumers, sourcing all their own ingredients…

IMAGE: Henry Jacques.

Sergio Momo of Xerjoff works with brilliant perfumers, such beautiful design. Those three companies I look at, not to copy, but you feel inspired naturally by them.

How many people are in your company?

Me. And my girlfriend Chloe. That’s it. I manage all the production, finance, international retailers, new product development… basically, manage all the company. Chloe manages the Harrods account and the social media and communications. But we’re really punching above our weight for what we are and do.

“We’re really punching above our weight for what we are and do.” – Steyn Grobler 

Steyn Grobler - Aqualis Utopia Parfum

OLFACTORY IDEAL: A rush of fresh blood orange gives way to the fruity nuances of apricot, osmanthus, pink peppercorn and rose in Aqualis Utopia Parfum. Not your average screechingly sweet fruity-floral, hallelujah. Created by Jean-Charles Mignon.

The Harrods deal is a huge coup. How did that come about?

Working with Ex Nihilo, I built up a direct relationship with them over a long time. It took three years for Harrods to accept the brand.

When you show big results over your career – for example, with Ex Nihilo and Boadicea – it gives them the confidence to launch the product. Huge investment also went into the actual presentation to them, which looked stunning.

And then there’s what you do there to grow it. It almost becomes a HR exercise. What sales staff do you employ, how do you strategise, but that’s also the fun part.

IMAGE: Aqualis.

What’s been your hardest (and most valuable) business lesson so far?

[Laughs] There’s a whole graveyard of lessons. No, the biggest thing is don’t burn bridges and work with people in the long term. As a younger guy and being South African, I might have been too stern and forward with my words and thinking, so I’ve learned to be very collaborative with people.

Steyn Grobler - Aqualis Namaqualand Parfum

BIRTHDAY BLOOMS: Inspired by the semi-desert region in South Africa which explodes with blooming wild flowers in July and August, Aqualis Namaqualand Parfum is big on the florals in a rather lovely way. Jasmine sambac, tuberose and ylang-ylang are all given their place in the African sun. Created by Florian Gallo.

Talking about your South African background, your heritage is proving to be a rich source of material. Was that intentional, or did it kind of happen along the way?

Each of them means something to me. Namaqualand blooms round about the time of my birthday. Kalahari is where my mum is from. Brenton is where my parents live now. Kruger [the president of the Transvaal in the 19th century] was my great, great grandfather. I didn’t set out wanting to make a South African brand, but these are such inspiring places.

Steyn Grobler - Aqualis Kruger Parfum

GOLD STANDARD: A double dose of the queen of florals in the form of rose oil and rose absolute (both from Turkey) is complemented by the soft leathery tones of saffron and papyrus in Aqualis Kruger Parfum. Cosy and chic. Created by Jean-Charles Mignon.

How do you brief your perfumers?

It’s quite different every time, but there are certain things that are consistent throughout my briefs: the highest concentration, no budgetary constraints on raw materials, which the perfumers love. It’s also important for them to have artistic freedom.

The briefs include what kind of person I envisage wearing it and what’s on the market already. They can’t be copies. I have this library [of references] in my head. You need a lot of knowledge about what’s going on in the industry.

IMAGE: Aqualis.

You mentioned Egoli when you were here in February. Tell us about that.

Egoli [the Zulu word for Johannesburg] is the place of gold and oud is liquid gold. I really wanted to use the notion of Johannesburg as a city built entirely on gold and now it’s a huge metropolis with Pretoria around it. And of course, I grew up around there.

It’s a unique take on oud in a parfum concentration, created by Chris Maurice who also did a lot of the Xerjoff fragrances. Unlike a lot of the big perfume conglomerates, he has a regular supply of the best oud in Laos.

Steyn Grober - Aqualis Egoli Parfum

IMAGE: Aqualis.

“I’m a bit of a purist in that way and wanted real oud, not accords or synthetic oud, to be used.” – Steyn Grobler

I’m a bit of a purist in that way and wanted real oud, not accords or synthetic oud, to be used. It’s stunning, with acidity, soft freshness from the bergamot note and this animalic musk-civet note.

REAL DEAL: Chris Maurice collaborated with Steyn Grobler to create Aqualis Egoli Parfum.

A brand is always a work in progress. What do you want to improve on Aqualis?

I started off with 50ml bottles, the concept that the strongest poisons come in the tiniest bottles, but there’s huge demand for 100ml bottles, so I’m working with an award-winning architect to create a shape for the 100ml. It will be sculptural.

IMAGE: Aqualis.

Now that I’m scaling the brand, we’re also working hard to come to solutions that are sustainable and luxurious and exclusive at the same time. For instance, the silk and foam inside the box are not sustainable and we can’t pump stuff out that gets thrown away.

IMAGE: Aqualis.

A lot of brands go through this journey. You look at Byredo and Roja Parfums, which have changed so much over the years, and you have this confidence, it’s fine to change it.

Running a perfume business takes a lot of cash. If I can ask the rude question, how have you done it?

Begged, borrowed and stolen [laughs]. I funded everything myself is the simple answer. I’ve been in high positions in companies. A lot of friends bought a house and I invested in a company. I love high risk [laughs again]. But then the company has grown organically in terms of its cash-flow, so whatever we’ve done, we’re not struggling to shift stock.

“Wherever there’s something that’s going to cost me a lot of money, I’ve ending up doing it myself.” – Steyn Grobler

Wherever there’s something that’s going to cost me a lot of money, I’ve ending up doing it myself. That’s also very much the South African way.

Aqualis fragrances are available in South Africa at Skins Cosmetics.

Quentin Bisch Parfums de Marly Delina Interview: “I Don’t Create Perfumes Thinking Of Success”

Parfums de Marly Delina - Quentin Bisch

The last time I interviewed Quentin Bisch, in 2018, the Paris-based perfumer was already making an impression with his creations for brands such as Chloé, L’Artisan Parfumeur, Etat Libre d’Orange, Mugler, Ex Nihilo and Jean Paul Gaultier.

Parfums de Marly Delina - Quentin Bisch

IMAGE: Givaudan.

Four years later, the Strasbourg-born Givaudan Perfumery School graduate has become highly sought after, so much so that this follow-up interview almost didn’t materialise due to his non-stop schedule.

IMAGE: Chloé.

Quentin Bisch made his fine fragrance debut in 2010 with Reminiscence Essence EDP. Most recently, he has produced fan favourites Hibiscus Mahajád (2021) and Patchouli Magnetik (2022) for French niche brand Maison Crivelli.

IMAGE: Fragrantica.

His creations for the Parfums de Marly Delina Range – Parfums de Marly Delina EDP (2017), Parfums de Marly Delina Exclusif EDP (2018) and Parfums de Marly Delina La Rosée EDP (2021) – are particularly popular.

When we got the opportunity to catch up over a half-hour phone call, we chat about the pressures of being in demand, the Parfums de Marly Delina line and the trickiness of working with roses. We also go into existential territory, which just adds to my admiration of his authenticity and sensitivity.

You are very in demand and are increasingly referred to as a “star perfumer”. How do you cope with the pressure and expectation?

Please don’t [sighs]. When I hear those kinds of things, I’m honoured and touched.

At the same time, it’s just not talking to me. Maybe because I’m strict with myself so I’m always seeking, doing research, looking at my next goals to achieve. So when I hear those compliments, it’s like people are nice, but that’s it.

“With the pressure, it’s only my pressure, which is quite huge. It’s sufficient and quite enough.”

With the pressure, it’s only my pressure, which is quite huge. It’s sufficient and quite enough [laughs].

I get the impression you’re a perfectionist.

Yes, maybe too much. But my self-engine that pushes me all the time is good like that too. Sometimes it’s a bit tricky. I can get into things in an obsessional way. It tends to take a lot in my life.

I still see myself as someone looking for something I haven’t accomplished yet. I feel young and new and having done nothing yet. There’s a huge gap between sometimes what I hear and what I feel in my head.

Apparently, you used to struggle with chemistry, an integral part of perfumery. How’s that part of the equation going now?

No. No [emphatic]. I have understood with experience you don’t need chemistry at all, in fine fragrances especially. Maybe if you’re working with household detergents and so forth, you do, but that’s not my domain.

You don’t need to foresee the chemical reactions in fine fragrances. You just need to perfume alcohol, which has no smell. I’m more of a chef mixing ingredients than a chemist.

IMAGE: Marc-Antoine Barrois.

You make it sound too easy, Quentin…

You’re right. Anybody can create, with a little training, something that smells good. There are some tricks. If you take vanilla, patchouli and labdanum, it smells amber, which is a beautiful accord. You can learn that trick.

To create beautiful perfumes that are modern, different and expansive is complicated because then you must adapt the art of mixing to the art of feeling what will be good, trendy and suits the brand. That is difficult.

Which would come from experience and intuition…

True. Intuition and lots of work. You need to try and try and fail and fail again to discover something nice and interesting. You need to be very patient. If you’re looking for something that’s rewarding quickly, perfumery is not for you.

“If you’re looking for something that’s rewarding quickly, perfumery is not for you.”

Let’s discuss the hugely successful Parfums de Marly Delina range. How much freedom were you given to create these fragrances?

Quite free, I must say. We presented to Julien [Sprecher], the olfactive director of the brand. At first, he didn’t like the note, but we insisted and he reconsidered. He asked me to do one single modification and that’s it.

Delina is powerful stuff. Was that part of the brief?

It’s very important to have that aspect in the whole package. It needed to be powerful and fluid – the way it’s distributed in the air – and transparent at the same time.

Parfums de Marly Delina - Quentin Bisch

How did you ensure Delina Exclusif is different from the original while keeping certain elements?

Exactly. It needed to be a continuation of the first one, like season two. If Delina was roses blooming in the garden at noon, full sun, a beautiful day, then Exclusif would be the same thing, but by night. It’s the same idea but with a different atmosphere.

I see you used Evernyl in the creation of Delina Exclusif. Did you prefer to use this synthetic moss rather than real oak moss?

When a perfumer uses a material, it’s not a basic choice between a natural and synthetic. I used Evernyl for a certain reason. It’s a different material. It’s like if you asked why I used hedione or benzyl acetate in place of jasmine. They’re three completely different materials.

“Creating a perfume is not a battle of choosing between natural and synthetic, good and bad. They’re a range of different ingredients.”

Creating a perfume is not a battle of choosing between natural and synthetic, good and bad. They’re a range of different ingredients.

Parfums de Marly Delina - Quentin Bisch

For example, using a high amount of rose essence oil sometimes is not good. It stinks because it’s too dark, too spicy. It’s a cocktail of molecules when you use the natural. The synthetic allows you to use just one part of the rose, so then you can create your own rose.

I’m enjoying the relative softness of La Rosée with its aquatic vibe. What was the idea there?

I thought it could be the prequel. The same rose, but in the morning and not fully bloomed at that moment. There’s a dewy, wet atmosphere. It’s transparent but still powerful.

Parfums de Marly Delina - Quentin Bisch

Are you surprised by the success of the range?

Yes! And everywhere! In Brazil, the Middle East, America, Russia, France. It’s crazy. That’s very interesting.

You never know if something is going to be a success. I don’t create perfumes thinking of that. Sometimes a beautiful fragrance can be launched at the wrong time and it misses the audience.

Parfums de Marly Delina - Quentin Bisch

All these Delina fragrances feature Turkish rose. Is this an easy ingredient to work with for you?

No, not at all. It’s beautiful but very powerful and can be a bit tricky. If you overdose it, it’s not modern.

For Parfums de Marly, it needed to be the legacy of this olfactory fantasy, tradition and modernity.

It’s really a duet of this rose, from Turkey and which is natural, and Petalia. This captive molecule from Givaudan [the company he works for] is a key ingredient of the modern rosiness of Delina. It keeps the litchi, fresh rose facet from top to bottom.

IMAGE: Givaudan.

Do you have a favourite ingredient to work with?

It changes all the time, like one’s mood. It depends on what you want to do. At the moment, it’s vanilla, because I’m working on something with it.

You know for Jean Paul Gaultier La Belle EDP, it started with le grand cru vanille, a delicious French cake with vanilla in all its states – powdery, dark, leathery. It was very interesting, the first time I was really trying to create an accord around vanilla and all its facets. From that day, I’m a vanilla-lover.

IMAGE: Jean Paul Gaultier.

Are you working on the next addition to the Delina range already? I know these things are confidential…

[Pause] Not for Delina. I can tell you I’m working on something else for Parfums de Marly.

If I read correctly, you turn 40 next year.

I turned 39 one week ago.

Hope it was a good celebration. Does it mean anything to you, as you approach that landmark year? Is this a time of reflection for you?

Definitely, but I’m always in that kind of state [laughs]. I’m always thinking about where I am, what I do, and asking myself: Are you doing the right thing? Are you doing it properly? And if not, change it.

IMAGE: Essential Parfums.

It’s tiring but also good because you’re sure you’re at the right place at the right moment and you’re not lying to yourself and others. I hate, hate not being honest with myself and others.

I can relate. It can keep you up at night, all those questions, especially when there are no answers.

Yes, yes. You can question something without having the answers. And then it follows you in your everyday life and sometimes, suddenly, you will have that revelation: now, I know this is for me, this is not for me anymore. We evolve all the time and I definitely have the feeling I’m not the same as before.

The Parfums de Marly Delina range is available in South Africa at Skins Cosmetics.

MAURICE ROUCEL INTERVIEW: “I’M ALWAYS IN CONTROL OF MY FORMULAS, TRYING TO PLEASE MY CLIENT – AND MYSELF”

Maurice Roucel Interview

IMAGE: Maison Rebatchi.

Maurice Roucel called me last week. Shameless name-dropping aside, I’ve always wanted to say that. After all, how often does a living legend respond to a flurry of emails with a phone-call to set up a time for an interview a week later. I gush about this Maurice Roucel interview because, in his nearly five decades-long career, he’s the man behind fragrances such as:

  • Rochas Tocade EDT (1994)
  • Serge Lutens Iris Silver Mist EDP (1994)
  • Hermès 24 Faubourg EDP (1995)
  • Lalique Pour Homme EDP (1997)
  • Gucci Envy EDT (1997)
  • Rochas Man EDT (1999)
  • Frédéric Malle Musc Ravageur EDP (2000)
  • Bond No 9 New Haarlem EDP (2003)
  • Guerlain L’Instant de Guerlain EDP (2003)
  • Donna Karan DKNY Be Delicious EDP (2004)
  • Lolita Lempicka L de Lolita Lempicka EDP (2006)
  • Guerlain Insolence EDT (2006)
  • Le Labo Labdanum 18 EDP (2006)
  • Nautica Voyage EDT (2006)
  • Amouage Reflection Woman EDP (2007)
  • Lancôme Hypnôse Homme EDT (2007)
  • Frédéric Malle Dans Tes Bras EDP (2008)

Maurice Roucel Interview - Rochas Man EDT

More recently, he has given niche brands such as Atkinsons, Cochine, Maison Rebatchi and Shalini his distinctive Gallic flair.

Maurice Roucel didn’t go the traditional route of perfume school. Starting at Chanel in 1973, where he worked with Henri Robert (creator of No 19 and Cristalle, pictured below), he taught himself the fundamentals of the profession. No doubt, his background as a chromatography chemist, with its techniques of separating a mixture into its individual components, gave him a technical edge.

IMAGE: Chanel.

His earliest fragrances included Henry M. Betrix Country EDT (1979) and Krizia K de Krizia (1981). In 1996, he joined the German fragrance and flavour company Symrise, which recognised him as a master perfumer – a rare accolade in the industry. Other achievements include the Prix François Coty (2002) and the Chevalier des Arts et des Lettres (2012).

IMAGE: Fragrantica.

When we get to chat properly, the Normandy-born, Paris-based perfumer is humorous, insightful and forthright. I try to find out what project he’s currently working on – rightly so, he insists it’s confidential. Instead, we talk about a wide range of subjects, including synthetics, ambers, keeping clients happy and approaching his latest career milestone.

Hope you enjoy reading this Maurice Roucel interview as much I did speaking with him.

Maurice Roucel Interview

IMAGE: Symrise.

You’re self-taught. How many years did it take before you knew the essentials?

[Laughs] I’m still learning. You always do in this business.

Musk seems to be one of your favourites. Why does it appeal so much to you?

Ah yes, I like musk, but I like to work with a lot of things. I don’t have a particular favourite.

“I like musk, but I like to work with a lot of things. I don’t have a particular favourite.”

While I must work to the ideas of client briefs, which are quite specific, personally I do enjoy something with the structure of musk, vanille [vanilla], ambery, sweet but not too sweet, comfortable. A little bit of the style, I would like to say, of Guerlain, Guerlinade [the house’s signature accord originally created by Aimé Guerlain in the late 19th century].

Maurice Roucel Interview - Frederic Malle Musc Ravageur EDP

You mentioned amber. There’s a lot of confusion about it…

At the beginning, ambergris came from the sperm whale. Nowadays, it’s frankly impossible. With animalics increasingly forbidden, you have synthetics or bases – perhaps you’ve heard of Ambre 93 from de Laire, for example.

You have sweet amber and dry amber. The product Ambroxan is dry ambery. When you are looking at the perfumery of Guerlain, the famous Guerlinade, it could be seen as ambery, but nothing to do with the original amber [laughs].

Ambre 83 from de Laire tries to add something comfortable, reassuring, feminine, enveloping, that kind of stuff.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Le Labo Labdanum 18 EDP

Perfumery relies on a mix of naturals and synthetics…

DKNY Be Delicious is totally synthetic.

And it’s great…

Yeah, it’s great, but it’s a question of the art of the perfumer to make something smell good.

How do you deal with the idea that “natural is best”?

It’s not the case. If you want to give the DNA of your perfume strong character, you need to use synthetics.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Maison Rebatchi Musc Panache EDP

PERSONAL PERFUME: In this Maurice Roucel interview, the perfumer reveals that Maison Rebatchi Musc Panache was initially created for himself. IMAGE: Maison Rebatchi.

You’ve created more than 150 perfumes in your career. Have you ever struggled with self-doubt or to come up with ideas or inspiration?

Maybe, I don’t know, I never count them.

Sometimes it’s difficult to find the right idea, for sure. But when you have it and it’s pleasing the client, we can work it for creating properly. Sometimes you can create something in one afternoon, as they say, sometimes it can take five to six years.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Nautica Voyage EDT

IMAGE: Nautica.

Hermès 24 Faubourg is one of my favourite creations of yours. It’s such a beautiful classic…

You know, originally I was not a fan of orange flower absolute, not my cup of tea. I was thinking at that time, the brief from Hermès was to create something around the Mediterranean, the sea, the sun. For me, Mediterranean countries mean orange flower, so that’s why I chose to work with it.

“It took four to five years to create the perfume. The people from Hermès are quite picky.”

And it took four to five years to create the perfume. The people from Hermès are quite picky. They are very demanding [chuckles]. When you have the scarves, the leather, everything is absolutely gorgeous, focused and very high quality.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Hermès 24 Faubourg EDP

Let’s talk about one of your more recent creations, Maison Rebatchi Musc Panache EDP [2019] which, coincidentally, I’ve just received from the company. Love its soft powderiness…

Originally, it was a perfume I created for myself. These ideas can then be proposed to a client and if they like it, they can then take it [laughs].

Maurice Roucel Interview - Maison Rebatchi Musc Panache EDP

PERSONAL PERFUME: In this Maurice Roucel interview, he reveals he initially created Maison Rebatchi Musc Panache for himself. IMAGE: Maison Rebatchi.

Do you have lots of these ideas waiting to be realised?

For example, you know, when I was, not so far from you really [I’m in Johannesburg, South Africa], in Réunion Island, I never smelled anything so beautiful in my life as the tiaré. So I was inspired and that became L’Instant de Guerlain.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Guerlain L’Instant de Guerlain EDP

IMAGE: Guerlain.

Is that how you find inspiration often? By travelling?

Inspiration can come from everywhere. Like with DKNY Be Delicious, I thought why not an apple, but an apple in my style. I like to add something different.

Are there certain compromises you’re not willing to make when working with a client?

Pleasing the client, that’s okay. But I’m always in control of my formulas, trying to please my client – and myself.

Going back to fruity fragrances, I discovered one of your less well-known creations from 2008, Adidas Natural Vitality EDT, on Fragrantica.

Which one? Is it me? Sorry, I don’t remember all my perfumes.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Adidas Natural Vitality EDT

You’re heading for 50 years in the industry in 2023. What’s been the biggest change in that time?

Yes, it’s a long life, a big part of my life.

When I started there were 20 to 30 maximum new perfumes on the market every year. Nowadays it’s 3 000 [laughs]. Everybody wants to launch a perfume.

To have a success, you need to move to the big trend. When Mugler Angel was launched [in 1992] it was not appreciated at all for its innovation. Three years later, a lot of people were making the sister, the nephew, the mother, the grandmother of Angel.

“A lot of perfumes don’t have strong inspiration. They do not stay in the memory as they have nothing specific.”

Meaning that a lot of perfumes don’t have strong inspiration. Investment in them is not in their quality but more the communication and publicity and so on.

You have a lot of perfumes on the market for one year, two years maximum. They do not stay in the memory as they have nothing specific.

Niche has some kind of answer to the desire of the client for something peculiar.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Lalique Pour Homme EDP

IMAGE: Lalique.

What one thing would you like to see change in the industry?

A partnership with the client. And not everyone trying to win the brief. For winning you need to be commercial, which is a pity for creativity.

But when you are working with somebody like Frédéric Malle, some companies like Chanel, Guerlain, you can find people in front of you who have a sense of perfumery at the right level.

Maurice Roucel Interview - Guerlain Insolence EDP

All images for this Maurice Roucel interview my own, unless stated otherwise.